As he detailed in his breakout hit movie The Big Sick, Kumail Nanjiani’s wife Emily is immunocompromised, and, with COVID-19, that changes everything. The comedian and actor opens up about the feeling of losing control in this crisis, but he and Andy can’t help but laugh their way through even a serious conversation about fear, love, and painful messages from society. Kumail also reveals some incredibly impractical things you can do in isolation.
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- Check out In Recovery with Dr. Nzinga Harrison, a new advice show from Lemonada Media about all things addiction. Premieres May 18 wherever you get your podcasts: http://www.lemonadamedia.com/show/in-recovery/
- Catch Kumail and Emily on their podcast Staying In with Emily & Kumail here: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/staying-in-with-emily-kumail/id1503412182
- Watch The Big Sick here: https://www.amazon.com/Big-Sick-Kumail-Nanjiani/dp/B07193L7RD
[00:43] Andy Slavitt: Welcome to In the Bubble, it’s Andy Slavitt and Zach. We have a great conversation today with Kumail Nanjiani, who is a comedian and an actor, and he made a movie, his own life story, that has striking similarities to the Covid-19 world called The Big Sick. He is a delightful guy and we have a conversation about what life is like at home and what it’s like living with someone who is at risk for Covid-19.
[01:15] Zach Slavitt: And also, Kumail has his own podcast with his wife Emily called Staying In with Emily and Kumail.
[01:20] Andy Slavitt: If you’ve listened to all of the In the Bubble podcasts from the beginning, then you can listen to Kumail’s. Kumail is actually really not only an entertaining guy, you can tell from this conversation what a wonderful guy he is, and I think you’ll find it very funny as well. So here’s Kumail.
[01:37] Andy Slavitt: Are you recording Kumail?
[01:38] Kumail Nanjiani: I am recording, yes.
[01:51] Andy Slavitt: So, Zach, who’s here, is my 18 year old son, was watching Silicon Valley late into the night last night.
[01:55] Kumail Nanjiani: Good. He’s got good taste.
[01:58] Andy Slavitt: He does. He does, his older brother had already watche it. And you’ve got a number of people who think you’re really funny guy in this house. We, of course, loved your movie. Let me introduce you to everyone. I think most people know you at this point, Kumail Nanjiani, a comedian, right? You’re a comedian. You admit to that?
[02:16] Kumail Nanjiani: I’ll admit to it. Guilty.
[02;18] Andy Slavitt: You made a movie about someone who gets a virus that then spreads throughout her organs and messes with her immune system. You admit to that?
[02:26] Kumail Nanjiani: Yes. Although it turned out to not be a virus. It was an autoimmune condition.
[02:32] Andy Slavitt: It was an autoimmune condition. You’re getting very science-y on me now. You want the podcast to be factual. I get it.
[02:43] Kumail Nanjiani: They thought it was a virus, so that’s true.
[02:44] Andy Slavitt: And then while she was in a coma, you decided to marry her?
[02:49] Kumail Nanjiani: Well, I — yeah. And then I ran it by her once she woke up.
[02:52] Andy Slavitt: Oh, yeah. That didn’t go that well at the beginning.
[02:58] Kumail Nanjiani: The proposal was not enthusiastic.
[03:02] Andy Slavitt: Right. And you got very close to her parents beforehand, which, who in America can’t relate to this situation? It’s the most unrelatable situation on one level, you made it into a highly relatable situation. Now you’re making a podcast that really is about staying home, which is fascinating. And then part of the podcast is helping people who have trouble as a result of having to stay home. So maybe let me start there. Staying home. Does it have to suck?
[03:31] Kumail Nanjiani: Staying home doesn’t have to suck. However, we’re in such a weird time that the other thing that we try and communicate is it’s OK to have days that do suck. You know, it’s don’t put too much pressure on yourself for anything. Sort of feel how you’re feeling. Be intentional about how you’re living your life. If you have a bad day, don’t be too hard on yourself. That’s sort of one of the main takeaways.
[03:55] Andy Slavitt: So what’s the best ratio of non-suck days to suck days?
[04:00] Kumail Nanjiani: I mean, it would be, you know, a million to zero. Or zero to a million, actually. I said it the wrong way.
[04:05] Andy Slavitt: That’s not realistic. You can’t even have that not during the Coronavirus.
[04:07] Kumail Nanjiani: Exactly. Well, the other thing that’s happening to me now that happens more than it’s ever happened is not just good and bad days, but within those days having multiple, multiple, good and bad days within each day. A lot of ups and downs. You know, I’m fairly lucky in that I’m not someone who’s ever had to deal with mental illness or depression or anything like that. But these last two months, it’s the closest I’ve gotten to knowing what that would feel like. Not to downplay people who have actual — who have those sort of diagnosed issues. But I sort of know that feeling of absolute powerlessness that sort of happens every now and then.
[04:47] Andy Slavitt: It’s scary because you think you’re turning on yourself, right? It’s almost like worse than a physical ailment because you’re like, oh, my God, I’m the problem and I don’t know how to solve it.
[04:57] Kumail Nanjiani: Well, and the issue is — there’s a couple issues. One is sort of the not knowing when this is going to end. And the other one is not feeling that you’re being taken care of. Like, I sort of feel like if you’re in a society, there’s a contract. There are certain things that I take care of. There are certain things that the people who are in charge take care of. And I would think a global pandemic is not something, unfortunately, that I can do very much about. It’s not on my list. I’m doing my part. I’m staying in, I’m wearing masks, I’m doing my part. But there has to be someone with more infrastructure who’s taking care of this. And I —
[05:38] Andy Slavitt: Like who owns this thing?
[05:39] Kumail Nanjiani: I know. Exactly. And I just feel — so, I had a pretty good week last week where I was feeling OK. And then two things sort of hit me on the same day. One was the estimate of death got doubled and people’s reaction was just so lax. That made me really, really sad, that people — like, we literally doubled the number of estimated fatalities from this thing, and people were like, OK, yeah, that sounds fine. The other thing that made me sad was this thought that I was like, we’ve quarantined ourselves for two months and the whole plan was to do that so that there would be a plan in place by the people who are actually in charge of this. And the thought that it seems like nothing or not enough has happened is disheartening.
[06:23] Andy Slavitt: Apparently, your expectations are way too high. No, it’s like — I mean, if you had told me 15 years ago that there would be shootings in schools and in churches and we would be like, yeah, that’s bad, that really shouldn’t happen, but, you know, and then just kind of go on. I feel like the same thing’s happening now. It’s like, yes, we had thousands of people die, but, you know, a lot of them are in nursing homes, and some of them are in jails, and some are in meatpacking plants. So it’s kind of like they’re just numbers. And I don’t think that’s how we all as Americans are reacting. I think it’s like how it all comes together as a presentation.
[07:06] Kumail Nanjiani: I think some of it’s got to be a defense mechanism, too, because the numbers are so staggering that there truly is no way to wrap your head around it. And at that point, there’s just no way to process what’s going on outside and how many people are affected by it.
[07:23] Andy Slavitt: But how much of it do you think is that it’s a pretty good proportion of people that people don’t feel are like them. In other words, they’re people of color, they’re older people. I don’t know how much of this plays into it or not, but like, I wonder if like this were afflicting people who own horses, you know, like if you own a horse farm or, you know, if you have a race car, if you have three homes, this really affects you. In that scenario, would we be responding differently to even smaller numbers of deaths?
[07:55] Kumail Nanjiani: I mean, I think you’re right. I think that’s a big part of it. If there’s any way somehow you can justify not being empathetic with that large number of group, I think people will find it. You know, once the number is so high, is so staggering, you have two ways to go. One way you go is what you suggested, which is you sort of build up a wall, you say those people are not like me. This doesn’t affect me. This isn’t my issue. I have to run my business, make money, all of that, comes from fear. I think it still comes from fear. I think a lot of the bad stuff we’re seeing on a large scale in our country is coming from fear. So there’s one way. And then the other way is to go, well, there’s really no way I can wrap my head around what’s going on outside, but I’m going to attempt to be empathetic, have compassion and do the best I can. I think those are sort of the two ways to go.
[08:46] Andy Slavitt: Do the best you can and help a little bit is a real tonic. I’m sorry. I mean, just you can’t affect the whole situation, as you said. It’s tons of wisdom in that. But, you know, what I can do is like this woman across the street who’s scared to death or who can’t get her groceries or whatever. Or you make someone laugh. You call someone on the phone you haven’t talked in a while. And you’re like, you’ve just done something.
[09:04] Kumail Nanjiani: Honestly, honestly, Emily says this. Helping people can also work as a selfish act. You know, you actually feel better about yourself when you do that. Andy, this is the other thing I just thought of, you know, when you were talking about people who are affected and how certain people just don’t seem to empathize with that. For me, the big divide came when we saw all those kids in cages. When I saw those pictures, I was like, “oh, there is no way anybody can justify this. This is a horrific sight. This is inhumane. And everybody has to agree with that.” And then I saw all these interviews with people that were like, well, you know, their parents were out of here. It’s not our fault. And when people were able to justify that, I was like, OK, now there is a very, very clear — we’ve just crossed a threshold and now I can’t really expect anything anymore.
[09:56] Andy Slavitt: Yeah. I don’t know how people are going to look back on this era like, you know, a couple of centuries from now. Like, I doubt they’re going to call this like the enlightened age, or the progressive era. This is maybe an era where we like woke up to some of the things that we’ve been doing for a long, long time in this country. But it’s also a period of time when we just kind of got a little less embarrassed about doing some bad things and kind of being OK with it.
[10:18] Kumail Nanjiani: I think what happened is — obviously, this is a very complicated issue. But one thing I’ve thought about a lot is, you know, you’re in this situation as me, too, where we all had life without the Internet. Then we had life with the Internet and mostly positive aspects of it. And then now we’re seeing sort of the negative sides of that. I think what used to happen is if somebody had sort of fringe, immoral views, I’ll say that — the promise of the Internet to me was you’ll be able to talk to people with different ideas, different backgrounds. It’s going to be like a very democratic thing. Everybody is going to be able to really, really engage in conversation with people who come from a very different place. What’s happened instead is we’re just talking to people who already agree with us. Some of these things that you’re seeing, people are less embarrassed about some of their ideas that they’re less embarrassed about, you know, embodying or parroting, I think part of it’s because they’re finding hundreds of other people online who agree with them. And then suddenly when you have some crazy, racist ideas and now suddenly there’s 200 other people who are like, “you’re right.”
[11:21] Andy Slavitt: That’s a good insight. And then you have great confirmation bias, because everybody I know thinks this way. Everybody I know hates immigrants. That must be the majority view. And then it’s like you got a whole bunch of other people who are like, I don’t know anybody like that. What I try to do, with very mixed success, is to try to understand where people are coming from and not question their motivation. In other words, OK, you have an opinion that might objectively sound racist. Now, I might meet you for five minutes and say, oh, that’s ‘cause you’re racist. And that may be easy. But it may be that you are supporting something that we would all maybe call structural racism or some of us would. And yet something is driving you that’s in your experience that’s not poorly motivated. I feel like that’s a lot of work to do. And a lot of people would listen and say, why do you even try? But I feel like at some level, if we don’t do some of that work and stop cursing half the population as being evil intended, that it will help. It’s also hard to go through life getting more and more amped up every day.
[12:26] Kumail Nanjiani: You know, Emily is so good at that. And it can be infuriating. I’ll be like railing on someone saying something. She’s like, well, actually, you know, probably they’re worried about this, this fear. I’m like, yes, I’m sure that’s true. You know, I have this weird thing. I’m 42 now and I’ve been a people pleaser my whole life. I really care what people think. I don’t want anyone to dislike me. And it was about like 10, 15 years ago. I had this thought. My first grown-up change I decided to make was I was like, just because I know why someone sucks, doesn’t mean they don’t suck. And that was a big grown-up decision. I was like, I see this as coming from insecurity, but this person is still a jerk. So it’s not my problem. They need to deal with their issues. I don’t need to see eye-to-eye with them. And that was a big grown up thing. Boy, my epiphany could not have been poorer timed. Like you said, you can’t live like that. You just, like, amp yourself up over and over.
[14:27] Andy Slavitt: There’s a new podcast that I strongly recommend that you subscribe and listen to. It’s also from Lemonada Media and it’s called In Recovery with Dr. Nzinga Harrison. I know Nzinga personally and I love her work. She’s a board-certified addiction medicine specialist who believes in a whole-person, comprehensive and compassionate approach to treating people with addiction. She thinks of addiction as a chronic illness, not a character flaw. Whether it’s opioids, alcohol, stimulants, food, gambling or anything else under the sun, particularly during this time of increased anxiety and isolation, we just know there’s an increased likelihood of challenges associated with addiction and other illnesses. So In Recovery is going to be your weekly go-to for any and all questions about addiction, treatment, recovery and everything in between. And I think you’re going to love listening to Nzinga. You can even get your questions answered by submitting them to inrecovery@LemonadaMedia.com. The show producers will make sure that your questions stay completely anonymous. So check out In Recovery with Dr. Nzinga Harrison wherever you’re listening to this podcast.
[15:38] Andy Slavitt: You have somebody you love who is susceptible, because of her immune system, to coronavirus. So first of all, does that frighten you?
[15:50] Kumail Nanjiani: Yes. I mean, we knew about this virus back in January. So it was something that I had been following because we don’t have the luxury of being lax about this because of Emily. And so it’s something that I’ve been following. And then it was a few weeks before things got, you know, before basically the NBA shut down and Tom Hanks and Rita Wilson got coronavirus, which I see as sort of the turning point in the public perception of this thing. But a couple weeks before that, nobody was taking it seriously. And I’d sort of been reading interviews with epidemiologists and all this stuff. And I was like, oh, this thing is coming here. It’s going to be a big deal. We have a weird few months in front of it. And right now is one we can do something to mitigate the eventual damage. But it felt like nobody was taking it seriously. My friends weren’t taking it seriously. And those two weeks were very, very tough. I had the first panic attack I’ve ever had in my life. I was very, very, very scared and completely out of control. And I’ve honestly never had a period like that where I felt like that. Like even when Emily was actually in her coma, and she was in a coma for eight days, and she was in the hospital for about a month, even during that, there was some measure of control. There’s one sense that people are working on it. People who know more than I do are taking care of it. And the other thing is, you’re sort of like getting up in the morning. You know, I really made like — you sort of, you know, use your activities as a salve. You get up. I have to do this. I have to go to the hospital. I have this schedule. I stay there. I talk to this doctor, talk to this doctor, talk to this doctor. At seven, when visiting hours are over, I come back home. You put one foot in front of the other and you sort of get through the days. With this, those two weeks, I couldn’t do that. I really lived in constant fear. One of the weekends, I was like, Emily, let’s go to a less populated city just for a weekend, just to get away. I need to clear my head. And I had such a meltdown while we were out of town staying at this hotel. You know, I remember we were at the breakfast buffet and this guy was walking around and he sneezed and there some touching a muffin and put it back down. And I was like, Emily, I am so sorry, we have to drive back right now. It was very, very, very scary.
[18:09] Andy Slavitt: I imagine there’s a lot of people that are going through pretty close to exactly what you’re feeling. Maybe not the exact circumstance, but pretty close. A loved one that they worry about, whether it’s a parent, maybe it’s themselves, and they’re not only dealing with that circumstance, but they’re just enveloped in the fear and the uncertainty. And I think you said something really smart before, the feeling that is anyone taking care of this? Does anybody care about me in this situation? What have you found are the best ways to cope and to kind of address that?
[18:43] Kumail Nanjiani: Well, one of the things that happened was in those days, I sort of somehow got in touch with — these were people I had known a little bit but a lot of other people who were in a similar situation. By that I mean people who had spouses or parents or children who were immunocompromised and who were in a high-risk group. So I ended up getting in touch with a lot of those people. And we were kind of really supporting each other and really talking about it and just hearing someone else articulate exactly what it is you’re afraid of. Exactly your worries are their worries, that really, really helped me a lot. Because honestly, Emily and I can’t talk about that. We have extremely different perspectives on this. We’re both terrified, but it’s this thing where — this has been an issue in our relationship since she got sick in 2007. And obviously it’s something we have to work on a lot more now is we were sort of dating for a while and then she got sick. And I think I probably had — Emily says this, and again, I don’t want to downplay people who actually have this, but I do think I have some amount of PTSD from that.
[19:55] Kumail Nanjiani: So there are certain things that really trigger me and then I sort of can’t see straight. And I think part of it is I probably felt guilt from, you know, she was sick back then. I didn’t see how sick she was. If I’d done something earlier, she wouldn’t have to be in the hospital for a month. So trying to prevent that. And then it’s different because I just feel like — it’s so irrational, but I’m like, I can protect her, you know? And I know how awful this sounds, but I have this feeling where I’m like, while I’m with her, she will not get this virus. So if she goes out for a walk on her own, I don’t like that. You know, if like we get packages, we have a whole, like, process for how we, you know, go through packages. We leave them out for a couple of days, clean them up. So when she goes out to clean them, I don’t like that. Like I want to do it. I feel somehow that I can protect her. And it’s really difficult for her to have someone so heightened about something like that, you know? And obviously it’s completely untrue. There’s nothing I could do. That’s the scary thing, right? Like none of us can do anything about it, but it triggers some deep emotional part of me that at some point I’ll go to therapy for.
[21:09] Andy Slavitt: Well, look, like the cool thing is you love her, obviously. And, you know, it’s questionable based on what you said, whether she loves you back.
[21:17] Kumail Nanjiani: She must, Andy, otherwise she would not be putting up with this.
[21:23] Andy Slavitt: No, I guess that’s true. I guess that’s true. She has to love you, because otherwise you’re just being way too difficult. But this PTSD thing — look, I’m not I’m not a licensed anything, but I can tell you that sounds very real. Like I do think that this idea of being in a situation where you lost control — thank god we’re alive today when you can actually recognize that and it’s acceptable to talk about it and deal with it. And there are professionals that can help you deal with it and so on. And anybody out there who is feeling things like this, that is so legitimate that even really famous, funny Hollywood people like Kumail feels the same way. And I think that should be encouraging, if nothing else.
[22:06] Kumail Nanjiani: Well, I want to say — there’s another thing about this that I have found that there is something I’ve been thinking about a lot for the last few years. That when we see these conversations online, I feel like we’re still in a place where men saying that they’re scared is considered not masculine, you know? And I see that a lot of the anti-mask people — you know, I’ll tweet about the importance of wearing masks and washing your hands, staying away from big crowds, whatever. And I have so many men responding to me as if I’m a coward. As if that’s what I’m doing is not manly. And I think a lot of that is tied up in this idea that, you know, men are not supposed to be scared. And I think a lot of that is playing into people’s reactions here, too.
[22:51] Andy Slavitt: I think this goes back to what we were talking about earlier, which is like everybody should be allowed to have one or two sucky days a week and then rotate them. So like, OK, you can’t have them all on the same day or like society would blow up. But like then if everybody knows, like it’s like a calendar on the wall in the refrigerator where it’s like, OK, it’s Monday, it’s Kumail’s crap day. So like everybody call him, check in, but you better call me tomorrow.
[23:18] Kumail Nanjiani: Exactly. Exactly. I’m doing this for you, you call me tomorrow. Emily has this thing she does call “the wallow,” which is she gives herself a little bit of time every day to just sit down and really worry. All those feelings that we’re sort of conditioned to push down, push away, fear, sadness, whatever it is, especially during this time, she sort of sits down. It’s kind of reverse meditating, right. Instead of clearing your head, you sit down and you just let everything in and you just sit in it. I think just admitting to yourself what you’re feeling is such a big part of the process.
[23:50] Andy Slavitt: Right. And I think it’s probably so second nature for you, but I think laughter is like a huge help, at least for me. Just seeing funny things about unfunny situations. People who listen to this podcast know that I’m like Dad-joking it to death here. People are rolling their eyes half the show. I just want to close with a couple of thoughts. One is there’s this movement afoot now to say, let’s just isolate the old people and the sick people and let’s let the rest of us get on with it because we have to fix the economy. I think about someone in Emily’s situation. You’re like, OK, so are you really saying that for like the next five years, 10 years of my life — because there’s no guarantee that someone with immune system issues can even take a vaccine. So you’re really saying we’re just going to say we’re going to write off a whole bunch of people, not all of whom are old. But even those of whom are old. Does that offend you? Does it strike you that way or am I hearing it differently?
[24:47] Kumail Nanjiani: No, I’m hearing it, too. I just find it very — at its basic, very impractical. So are you saying that everyone over the age of 70 just can never be in contact with someone under the age of 70? Because here’s the thing: Emily’s immunocompromised. She’s in that group. I’m not. So then basically, I don’t leave the house either.
[25:07] Andy Slavitt: Right. You make a choice, right? You either have a life or you can be with her.
[25:12] Kumail Nanjiani: It’s just completely impractical. I just don’t see how it works. I actually have friends who will, like text me and be like, all right, enough. We should just like cordon off the people, quarantine the people who are sick, who are in a high-risk group. How do you do that? There’s no way to do that. It makes no sense to me.
[25:25] Andy Slavitt: It’s also just like if we think all people are created equal — and you know, there’s this great quote — I used to work in the Department of Health Human Services. And Hubert Humphrey has this quote on the wall, which has the effect of ‘our society is defined by how we treat people on the margins, the older, sick or the people with disabilities.’ And it’s like I don’t want to forget that.
[25:43] Kumail Nanjiani: Exactly. I mean, that’s even the most — you’re appealing to, like a basic sense of humanity, which I don’t know if that’s something we can count on right now. But look at retirement homes, right? There are older people there, but the people who work there aren’t older people. So now are you saying that those people can’t go home and see their families? It just doesn’t make any sense.
[26:05] Andy Slavitt: Yes. Well, I think the summation of all that is let’s not act out of fear. We all have that fearful side of us for sure. We all have that selfish side of us. But if we can get through this period and make decisions calling on the best of us, because, like we all have that inside us, we’ll do much better. Final question for you and then I’ll let you go. This is so much fun talking to you.
[26:27] Kumail Nanjiani: Yeah, this is great. Thank you for talking to me. You know, your threads have been very, very helpful to me because what I don’t like, as I said earlier, is the not knowing. And the people in charge just sort of placating. And you can tell that actual information is not on the agenda there. So your threads have really helped me, even though, you know, a lot of times it’s not news that’s necessarily — it’s not stuff you want to hear, but it still helps because I’d rather be informed than not.
[26:55] Andy Slavitt: I appreciate it. I appreciate you talking about my Twitter threads and not my sewing.
[27:01] Kumail Nanjiani: No, I don’t think you’re sewing threads are making anybody feel better.
[27:05] Andy Slavitt: Let me finish on this. What are three things people may not have thought of that are cool things to do at home?
[27:12] Kumail Nanjiani: Wow. So, OK, sit in a new chair. This is something we’ve been doing. Just like just like sit in a new chair, you know, because we are always on the same exact couch that sometimes feels like I’ll come in and she’ll be sitting on like the green chair that’s only for guests. I’m like, Emily, what are you doing? She like things just look different from here. What are you gonna do?
[27:33] Andy Slavitt: I got to ask the judge. Zach, should we count that as one? Zach says yes, that’s acceptable for one.
[27:37] Kumail Nanjiani: All right. All right. I mean, the other thing is, I know a lot of people have been like rearranging their furniture. I don’t know if that’s helping people.
[27:48] Andy Slavitt: That’s very close to the first one. Zach, do we count that independently? Zach thinks it’s the same idea.
[27:57] Kumail Nanjiani: OK. Hold on one sec. Let me ask. Hey, Emily. Emily, can you give me two real quick things that people can do that they haven’t thought to do around the house? I already said sitting in a new chair.
[28:13] Emily Gordon: Uhhh. You can take a shower in your sink.
[28:17] Kumail Nanjiani: Oh, Emily says, can you take a shower in your sink? Emily, one more.
[28:34] Emily Gordon: Uhhh. Have you been under your bed lately?
[28:38] Andy Slavitt: Ok!
[28:39] Kumail Nanjiani: And she’s putting her headphones back in as if she’s, like, sure of the success of this.
[28:44] Andy Slavitt: I think you’ve given the audience some things to do. Just a great list.
[28:49] Kumail Nanjiani: I will tell you what I am doing. You know, back, like earlier, I bought a bunch of DVDs and Blu-rays that are sort of like aspirational DVDs. You buy like some Swedish show, three seasons because you’re like, oh, yeah, I’m cultured. And I’m trying to watch those now. And a lot of that stuff is actually really good.
[29:08] Andy Slavitt: Watch it from under your bed. Well, thank you so much, Kumail. This was really fun and I really appreciate what you guys are going through and you shared it. And let’s all get through this thing together, man.
[29:20] Kumail Nanjiani: Yeah. Thank you. Thank you for your Twitter threats. They’ve been very, very good.
[29:32] Andy Slavitt: I want to thank Kumail for that conversation and Emily for those really terrific contributions at the end. Very, very helpful. So he has a new show coming out, right? What’s it, Zach?
[29:43] Zach Slavitt: He has a new show on Netflix coming out May 22nd called The Lovebirds.
[29:48] Andy Slavitt: Well, after that conversation, I’d watch anything he does. Actually before the conversation.
[29:52] Zach Slavitt: And also, remember to check out his podcast, Staying In with Emily and Kumail.
[29:55] Andy Slavitt: Check out his podcast after you’ve listened to all of our podcasts. Coming up on Wednesday, we’ve got a great podcast for you. It is with Chelsea Clinton, who, among other things, runs the Clinton Foundation. She has a couple of very famous parents. She is a person who does not do a lot of interviews, media. So I think it’s going to be quite interesting. She’s really a terrific person and I think you’ll enjoy it. Stay tuned. We’ll see you Wednesday.
[30:21] Andy Slavitt: In the Bubble is a production of Lemonada Media. Niccole Galteland is our producer and Ivan Kuraev is our editor. Music is by Dan Molad and Oliver Hill. Zach Slavtii is our co-producer and my co-host. You can find out more about our show on social media @LemonadaMedia. And you can find me on social media at @ASlavitt on Twitter, @AndySlavitt on Instagram. If you liked what you heard today, tell your family and friends, but tell them at a distance. For now, stay safe. Share some joy. We’ll get through this together. And #StayHome.